Episode 9

[0:00] All right, and we're back to the fake browns podcast.

[0:03] What's going on, dude?

[0:06] Oh, you know, just chillin'.

[0:07] Just chillin'?

[0:08] This is what we do here at the fake browns podcast.

[0:10] We fuck chill.

[0:11] We work out and we talk about our feelings.

[0:14] I think that's the fucking truth.

[0:16] Well, I think we got to do this to start off with today.

[0:19] And that is what the fuck is magic.

[0:22] And I'm not talking about fentizmal fictional magic

[0:27] from books and video games and ancient lore.

[0:31] But the magic we see today, like a Chris Angel or a David Blaine.

[0:36] Which I would argue are the pinnacles of that.

[0:37] They're still working, those guys.

[0:39] David Blaine, dude.

[0:40] Weird side tangent.

[0:42] This is my buddy in Salt Lake City.

[0:45] We're out doing things all day, having fun, hiking, hang out with friends.

[0:49] Then the last time they were like, let's just watch a movie and chill.

[0:52] We've done so many things.

[0:53] And we find out that there's a movie of David Blaine's most recent big stunt.

[0:59] And he just ties himself to a bunch of balloons and flies like 4,000 feet in the sky.

[1:05] And granted, you read that like, that sounds awesome.

[1:10] And the whole, it's so boring.

[1:12] Yeah.

[1:13] It's essentially up.

[1:14] Yeah.

[1:14] But it's...

[1:15] He'd like pivoted from doing magic to just doing crazy shit.

[1:20] Yeah.

[1:20] It's not even a magic trick.

[1:22] It's just like, why are you doing this?

[1:23] Yeah.

[1:24] And it's like, you know, the thing before that I knew him for was he held his breath for like 17 minutes in that chamber.

[1:30] Did you see that underwater?

[1:31] Yeah.

[1:31] There was like the last big thing I saw.

[1:33] And this one's literally like, there's a whole team of people.

[1:36] He ties himself to a bunch of...

[1:38] It's not like, how you imagine it?

[1:40] It's like, he's in a thing with a bunch of balloons.

[1:43] Yeah.

[1:43] And it's crazy.

[1:45] But it's not like this feet of man that's...

[1:48] I don't know.

[1:48] It doesn't seem like he's doing it.

[1:50] Yeah.

[1:50] Do you see the one where he caught a bullet in his mouth?

[1:53] Yeah.

[1:53] But I don't remember how that...

[1:55] He just like, he holds a mouthpiece thing.

[1:58] I was like, they shoot it into there.

[1:59] And a guy shoots him.

[2:00] So it's like, he has to be really still.

[2:02] That's the trick.

[2:03] Yes, yeah.

[2:05] Still crazy.

[2:06] What's that?

[2:06] What are we doing?

[2:07] Also, if that missed...

[2:11] Oh, here's just blows out of it.

[2:12] I mean, that's like, dude, he's just dead then.

[2:14] That'd be crazy.

[2:15] I think it was a documentary.

[2:16] It wasn't live.

[2:17] That'd be crazy if it was live.

[2:19] Man, I'd pay to see that.

[2:20] Yeah.

[2:21] That'd be awesome.

[2:21] Well, also the one he hung upside down for like three days, I was kind of crazy.

[2:25] I didn't know he did that.

[2:27] I thought you just died.

[2:29] You're supposed to.

[2:30] So that one was kind of like...

[2:32] He had doctors there and they're like, yeah, he's...

[2:34] He should be dead by now.

[2:36] Jesus Christ.

[2:37] Because there's that one famous...

[2:40] Spalunker.

[2:40] You know those people...

[2:41] We've talked about this before.

[2:42] The super anxiety-ridden thing...

[2:44] That's the cave guy.

[2:44] Yeah, the cave guy.

[2:45] He fell.

[2:47] He got stuck upside down in this small little crevice and died in 24 hours because you

[2:53] go into cardiac arrest if you're upside down for that long.

[2:55] Yeah.

[2:56] Let's start.

[2:56] Oh, David Blaine's doing...

[2:58] He should have gone save that dude.

[3:01] Yes.

[3:02] I mean, I think he was about to die when they flipped him right side up.

[3:07] Oh, oh, he said he was like...

[3:09] He pushed the limits.

[3:10] Yeah.

[3:11] Yeah.

[3:11] I mean...

[3:13] Yeah.

[3:13] Dude, his eyes were all fucked up.

[3:15] I've never seen him after the holding his breath on a water one.

[3:18] It's like the veins in his body.

[3:20] Like, you could...

[3:21] It's like, almost he didn't have a skin.

[3:23] It was fucking nuts.

[3:24] His body was like so deprived of oxygen that it was like squeezing everything out of his

[3:29] body.

[3:29] It was fucking crazy.

[3:30] Anyway.

[3:32] And then...

[3:33] That was a tangent.

[3:35] But this magic stuff that's been going on for a while, I don't know what it is.

[3:42] I don't understand.

[3:44] I get how like...

[3:46] It's all fake.

[3:47] You could...

[3:47] I mean, it has to be on some level.

[3:50] They're doing something.

[3:51] But when...

[3:51] If I'm 10 feet across the room and, you know, guys like, hey, think of a card and I think of the Queen of Hearts and he goes looking your shoe.

[4:00] And I haven't had any contact with this man ever in my life.

[4:03] Unless they just have teams of private investigators that are like waiting for me and just putting stuff around my home.

[4:08] But obviously that's not happening in these like videos or performances where there's these big, famous magicians.

[4:16] How the fuck do they do that?

[4:18] Is it just planning?

[4:19] Are you like the second you enter this person's home, you're just planting shit everywhere?

[4:24] It's funny because it's like a different skill than magic.

[4:27] It's just crazy, slight a hand and deception.

[4:32] Which...

[4:32] And they make money off it.

[4:34] I mean, it's cool.

[4:34] Don't give me your own.

[4:35] If someone does that show, like, that's...

[4:37] I don't understand.

[4:38] Have you seen the Carbonaro effect?

[4:41] It's like a...

[4:42] This guy who just does magic on TV.

[4:45] But like, there's a lot of cuts.

[4:47] And I never know, like, how real it is.

[4:50] Like, how crazy is a stuff he's doing versus...

[4:52] Yeah.

[4:52] ...just produced.

[4:54] Yeah, when it's cut.

[4:55] It's crazier to see a life.

[4:56] Yeah, for sure.

[4:57] I mean, I've seen stuff where it's like recorded.

[5:00] Like, they go to see Chris Angel.

[5:02] Which, I don't even know, Chris Angel is still doing his stuff anymore.

[5:04] But they go to a place where it's just a live video of the event.

[5:08] And they're doing shit, so there's no cutting makes me guess or think that...

[5:12] Yeah.

[5:13] ...the potential for just...

[5:14] All right.

[5:15] You can do whatever you want.

[5:16] Yeah, exactly.

[5:17] It's film.

[5:18] But I love...

[5:19] Do you know any magicians?

[5:21] No, no.

[5:22] That'd be...

[5:23] I've known one.

[5:25] Yeah.

[5:25] Yeah.

[5:25] My growing up, my cousin was dating this guy.

[5:30] This is also around the time where Chris Angel was becoming huge.

[5:34] This guy was like a...

[5:36] A lesser Chris Angel.

[5:38] He dressed like, had like, chains and goth kind of stuff.

[5:42] And was he good enough to get that title?

[5:44] He did a couple of card tricks.

[5:45] Okay.

[5:46] I remember being like, oh, that's great.

[5:47] But it wasn't like...

[5:48] Have you ever done a card trick?

[5:50] Have you ever done one?

[5:51] No.

[5:51] No, no, no.

[5:52] Like, you can just look up some pretty cool card tricks.

[5:55] Yeah, I don't doubt that.

[5:56] Yeah.

[5:56] But this guy...

[5:57] I remember specifically, you know,

[6:00] this is on my dad's side of the family,

[6:02] which is very extremely Catholic.

[6:04] They're from Cuba.

[6:06] And the cousin is my dad's sister's daughter.

[6:10] And he's dating this guy who's like,

[6:13] has tons of piercing, spiky blonde hair.

[6:17] Looks like an animate character almost.

[6:20] Super tight, jeans.

[6:21] And there's just walking around asking, like,

[6:23] we'd go to family events.

[6:24] I'd be like, why is he a trick?

[6:25] Like...

[6:25] So he's just trying to be Chris Angel.

[6:28] Yeah.

[6:28] Like, he just probably was wanting to do magic.

[6:32] Chris Angel was the big guy at that time.

[6:34] And just assumed that identity.

[6:36] And until I got older, I didn't realize how ridiculous that was.

[6:39] To be like a family party.

[6:41] And a guy being like, to adults,

[6:43] not just kids being like,

[6:45] I got some magic stuff I've been working on.

[6:46] And this is what I do.

[6:47] Grant, you can make a living out of it.

[6:50] It was just such a...

[6:51] As a kid.

[6:52] Kind of cool.

[6:53] Just different.

[6:54] It's like doing an open mic, basically.

[6:56] And a family party.

[6:58] Yeah.

[6:58] And an extremely Hispanic religious side of the fan.

[7:03] It was such a strange place to start.

[7:06] Is the religious anti-magic?

[7:08] Is that why you say that?

[7:09] No, it just is a very...

[7:11] What is this devil that you're bringing in this house?

[7:13] Yeah, like that, maybe more.

[7:15] Where it's like, they're conservative and religious.

[7:18] And like, the God thing doesn't help.

[7:21] Sure.

[7:21] Where it looks like more leaning towards the devil than it is God.

[7:26] Okay.

[7:26] I honestly have no idea what my grandparents thought of this man.

[7:30] But I remember being like,

[7:32] you can sew what we're there and we're having the family party.

[7:36] You can see him from a mile away.

[7:38] Like, he stands out so hard.

[7:40] And the way he's talking and asking people to do tricks,

[7:43] I'm like, at the time, I'm like, oh, magician.

[7:45] Which it was normal for me as a kid.

[7:47] But I look back like that's probably so strange.

[7:49] Did they have any good ones?

[7:51] Once again, I'll remember with some card tricks.

[7:53] Where it's like, oh, you guessed my card.

[7:55] But nothing other than that.

[7:58] Remember, there was something with like balls that he had?

[8:02] Some like...

[8:03] Oh, it was class.

[8:04] It was something like that or some like,

[8:06] kind of these metal rings and balls that like...

[8:08] Oh, because like, take them all.

[8:09] Everyone does the rings.

[8:10] The rings stupid.

[8:11] I'm a kid, man.

[8:12] I'm like, that's cool.

[8:13] Yeah.

[8:14] But only magician I ever knew.

[8:17] Which, I don't know.

[8:18] I also date someone who thought...

[8:20] Did he make it?

[8:20] What's he doing now?

[8:21] I don't even remember his name.

[8:22] Man.

[8:23] That's how fleeting that memory was.

[8:26] I dated a girl who thought magicians

[8:27] she had a weird attraction towards magicians.

[8:30] Wow.

[8:31] And...

[8:31] That's the opposite.

[8:33] The F.

[8:34] Yeah, I had never met a girl who was like,

[8:36] oh, magicians didn't do it for me.

[8:37] She was like, something about not knowing what they're doing.

[8:39] I was like, I can see, I can understand that.

[8:43] But I'm like, I don't.

[8:45] Anyway, we go...

[8:47] You know what this place called Safehouse in Milwaukee is?

[8:49] Yeah.

[8:50] It's like, have you been there?

[8:52] I have not.

[8:52] I've heard of it.

[8:53] Okay.

[8:53] So, you know, you're like, going there.

[8:55] It's fun.

[8:56] But it's like, we went there with another couple.

[8:59] And the longer we are there, the more we felt like it was for kids.

[9:02] And when we're...

[9:04] There's alcohol there, but you go in.

[9:06] There's a magician who's the bartender.

[9:08] And I remember being there and being like,

[9:10] is she just getting off to this?

[9:12] Like, it was weird.

[9:13] Oh.

[9:13] I was like, is she...

[9:15] Is that just in your head or did you

[9:17] where they're indicators that...

[9:19] No, it was probably just in my head, honestly.

[9:21] But there is that thing when a girl explicitly tells you,

[9:25] man, I'm really turned on by this thing.

[9:26] Oh, I'm at it head.

[9:27] And then it's in front of you and you go,

[9:30] huh, this is...

[9:32] I don't know.

[9:33] I don't know how to handle that situation.

[9:36] Like, I can appreciate you.

[9:38] You just don't freak out.

[9:40] That's how you hang out.

[9:41] Oh, absolutely.

[9:42] I mean, but it's such a...

[9:45] I don't know.

[9:46] It's so strange because I've never gone...

[9:48] Well, maybe I have.

[9:49] I shouldn't say never.

[9:50] But if I'm dating someone, I'm like,

[9:52] man, something about women's volleyball players just really does it for me.

[9:57] Oh, we can't say that.

[9:58] And then we go to a women's volleyball game and I'm just sitting there.

[10:01] I feel like it's just...

[10:04] It's a little weird.

[10:05] Is that a double standard?

[10:07] Can guys do that?

[10:10] Yeah.

[10:11] Or are you saying can guys...

[10:13] Like, I feel like I would get crucified.

[10:15] If I was in a relationship and I just talked about...

[10:17] Things I like in women that aren't in the woman that I'm dating.

[10:21] Yeah.

[10:21] I think it's definitely doubles.

[10:23] That would be...

[10:23] Because I've seen...

[10:24] I mean, I'm only saying this because I've seen so many memes made about this thing where it's like...

[10:30] Or someone wrote on some chat forum that was like,

[10:33] yes, so...

[10:35] My girlfriend says that if I have any celebrity crushes, like,

[10:39] she's gonna break up with me, but then she tells me that she's gonna...

[10:42] She would...

[10:43] She met John Mayer.

[10:44] She would suck his dick in front of her dad.

[10:46] That's John Mayer.

[10:47] Yeah, I don't know.

[10:48] So, it's a weird upset...

[10:49] Like, just celebrity crush kind of deal.

[10:51] But if I said that to any girlfriend of like,

[10:54] man, if Jennifer Lopez was in the room,

[10:57] I would just fucking plaster.

[10:59] Regardless of who's there.

[11:01] That's a crazy thing to say, first of all.

[11:03] Front of her dad.

[11:04] In front of Jennifer Lopez's dad.

[11:06] Yeah.

[11:08] But I don't know.

[11:09] I also wouldn't test those waters in a relationship.

[11:12] Aside from it being shitty,

[11:13] it's not gonna be a good reaction.

[11:15] Or they're gonna pretend it's okay.

[11:18] And then they're just gonna push that shit down.

[11:19] It comes up a week later in some different way.

[11:22] How did you react when she said she was in a magician's?

[11:26] And you're like, I'm not a magician.

[11:27] When you're not in front of a magician,

[11:29] it's funny to be like, that's kind of weird.

[11:32] That one's almost benign enough to wear.

[11:34] Like, I would think that's funny.

[11:35] And I think both ways.

[11:37] There was no part of me that thought that her and I

[11:39] would ever be in front of a magician when she said that.

[11:41] And then we arrived at a situation where we're in front of a magician.

[11:45] And I'm like, oh no.

[11:47] Well, what if she said something like,

[11:49] I love dudes with blonde hair.

[11:52] Like, things that just aren't you.

[11:53] That aren't me.

[11:54] That'd be pretty fucked up.

[11:55] That'd be weirder, right?

[11:56] That's weirder than magician.

[11:58] Magician is an attainable thing.

[12:00] I guess blonde you could bleach your hair.

[12:02] So you were okay with that because you're like,

[12:04] I could become a magician.

[12:05] I mean, I don't know if that's the reason why I was okay with it.

[12:07] But I see, it's more okay to be,

[12:11] there's two factors here.

[12:12] The rarity of a magician in my life,

[12:14] which I had only ever known one that was at family parties one time.

[12:18] And the fact that it's a thing that you train to become.

[12:24] It's not like a specific blonde.

[12:28] Also, you could dye your hair, but like say,

[12:30] I only like Hispanic men, or say,

[12:33] I only like German men to me, which I'm out.

[12:35] Well, I'm, okay.

[12:36] I only like, I'm a lot of things.

[12:38] Only like whatever I'm not pure German men.

[12:42] Yeah, exactly.

[12:43] I'd be like, I don't know.

[12:48] That'd be weird.

[12:49] This comes into the thing.

[12:50] Do you think some thoughts are just better to never ever?

[12:53] What are your head?

[12:54] Like, this is a good example of us.

[12:55] Yes.

[12:55] Yeah, I think so.

[12:57] I'm thinking of some right now.

[12:58] Never gonna say.

[12:59] I want to know.

[13:02] So the other thing about the magician,

[13:04] that's not like a very,

[13:06] it's not like a very looked up to profession.

[13:09] Sure.

[13:10] Like, what if she said, I only like lawyers?

[13:13] That would be more,

[13:15] that would be shittier, right?

[13:16] Yeah.

[13:17] Oh, yeah.

[13:17] For you?

[13:18] Yeah.

[13:18] I think especially at that time.

[13:20] Because you'll never be a lawyer.

[13:22] Oh, she's a liar.

[13:24] At that point too, I was a teacher.

[13:25] So I was like, I mean, talk about.

[13:29] I think if your profession is equal or better,

[13:32] then it's okay.

[13:33] Now someone said lawyer, I'd be like, that's...

[13:36] Yeah.

[13:36] I feel a lot more comfortable.

[13:37] Because, I mean, call me shallow,

[13:40] but tying my financial state to it tends to,

[13:43] when I was making $30,000 a year,

[13:46] it was almost a direct causality relationship

[13:49] of like how my mood was.

[13:52] Aside from just literally trying to survive,

[13:55] just like, I can't do anything with my money,

[13:57] and everyone around me is doing better.

[13:59] It's like, oh, it's just as the worst fucking problem.

[14:02] Yeah.

[14:02] It's hard to have this like in light and state

[14:04] that everyone talks about.

[14:05] It's not about money, but when you're poor,

[14:08] it's fucking sucks.

[14:09] It's a low a certain line.

[14:10] It's 100% about money.

[14:12] Yeah.

[14:12] People get it so fucked up where they're like,

[14:15] all the rich people care about is money.

[14:17] But it's actually the poor people who care about money the most.

[14:19] Because you have to think about it.

[14:21] Money ain't a thing if you got it.

[14:23] There's a guy who said that.

[14:25] I don't fucking know.

[14:26] That's some wrapper.

[14:27] But it's true.

[14:27] You don't think about it.

[14:28] What's you have it?

[14:29] Right.

[14:30] You need...

[14:31] You still should be smart with it.

[14:33] For sure.

[14:33] But when you're poor, you need to think about it.

[14:35] Because it can make the difference if you've been living inside and outside.

[14:38] Yeah.

[14:39] You know, like you have to.

[14:40] So there's no choice.

[14:41] Yeah.

[14:41] And it's like people get on poor people's cases for being stingy or doing...

[14:46] It's like, no, because it doesn't matter.

[14:48] It will make a difference in your life if you lose a hundred bucks.

[14:50] But to them, it could.

[14:52] Yeah.

[14:53] It's way more impactful.

[14:54] That's a good thing to be if you're poor.

[14:57] You should be stingy.

[14:58] Yeah.

[14:59] Ain't that the truth, brother?

[15:02] That's financial advice.

[15:03] That's right.

[15:04] We give a lot of advice on here.

[15:07] Where's it going with this?

[15:08] The magician thing, girlfriend of the time, thought, magician of the hop, felt weird about it.

[15:12] Never addressed it.

[15:13] But also it's one of those things where you address and then what's going to come up at conversation?

[15:17] Did it bring nothing?

[15:19] So you knew the guy was a magician.

[15:22] Did he do a trick for you guys?

[15:23] Yeah, he was doing car tricks behind the bar and stuff like that.

[15:25] Okay.

[15:26] Doing like pulling stuff out of places.

[15:28] And I'm like, there's a part of my brain that goes, is she just getting turned on by this?

[15:33] Yeah.

[15:33] And then it was, dude.

[15:35] Very likely.

[15:36] Yeah.

[15:37] But hiding it well.

[15:38] Damn.

[15:39] But then it's like, is that how do I think that's wrong?

[15:42] If you have a certain thing you're into and it turns you on, like, what are you going to do?

[15:48] Stop me from being turned on by something?

[15:51] That's, you can't do that.

[15:52] Yeah.

[15:53] How the rest of the night go?

[15:55] Fine.

[15:56] I mean, we got down with, I mean, it was me and we're us in a couple, like I said before,

[16:01] and then we went out, went back home at a sexy night and it was fine.

[16:06] Yeah, everything was good.

[16:07] Pretend to be a magician now.

[16:09] I tried so hard.

[16:09] Yeah.

[16:10] Yeah.

[16:11] I might cut this, but I'm pretty sure that's the night where I don't know why, but I thought it was,

[16:17] and it might have been related to the magician thing, but I'm pretty sure I said I love you that night to make it like.

[16:22] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[16:24] I'm pretty sure it was like, this was me topping the night.

[16:29] Like this was me making, taking control of the night is shitty and silly is that sound.

[16:34] Wow, dude.

[16:35] And granted.

[16:37] Manipulative as fuck.

[16:39] I mean, granted, felt it.

[16:41] There's probably just no, it was like, you know, it just happened to happen.

[16:45] I'm not doing this for the night, dude.

[16:48] For me, real this back into my control.

[16:52] Yeah, I'm making the awful night for me.

[16:53] Wow.

[16:54] Yeah.

[16:55] I think so.

[16:56] But guys will say anything.

[16:59] Yeah, I mean, there's worse things.

[17:01] Yeah, for sure.

[17:02] I mean, it could have been I wasn't feeling at all and just like truly chose to be like, yeah, lie, but it wasn't a lie.

[17:09] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[17:10] So it was not sure, but it just happened that happened on that night.

[17:15] So magic's crazy.

[17:17] I guess, I don't know if we're going to have a solution or to magic.

[17:21] Yeah, we got to know what the fuck are they doing?

[17:25] They're fucking magic.

[17:25] Yeah, they're proud of the problem.

[17:28] Yeah, I don't know.

[17:29] I'd like to, if any magicians are out there from our viewers, you let us know.

[17:35] I know all our viewers.

[17:36] Shut the fuck up.

[17:39] All right.

[17:40] I think we hit that one in a good way.

[17:44] This is short and stupid, but the duck face is still alive and well, which I never thought.

[17:48] Oh, yeah.

[17:49] It came out as we grew up, ish, not to date ourselves and give our age up, but it was something I thought that was going to be really short lived.

[18:00] But I don't know how many times and God damn it.

[18:03] I feel like I sound like a broken record with talking about dating apps on this fucking podcast, but there are still so many girls doing that fucking duck face.

[18:11] Yeah.

[18:11] So many.

[18:13] And have you ever looked at a duck face and gone?

[18:15] Nice.

[18:16] That's so hot.

[18:17] It's the hottest thing.

[18:18] That's my thing.

[18:19] That like, you see girls with a duck face?

[18:21] Yeah, yeah.

[18:22] Just a little lose it.

[18:23] Well, no, and the people do the Snapchat filters on their pictures.

[18:29] There's like dog ears on them.

[18:30] People still do that.

[18:31] Oh, man.

[18:32] I just think I'm looking at a kid.

[18:34] Yeah.

[18:35] That's the immediate vibe I get is, like, they haven't grown up.

[18:41] Which is probably fucking weird.

[18:44] I don't know.

[18:45] I'm probably not able to say that, but it just seems so childlike when you're doing this.

[18:50] So you as Annie filter on your face, there's also one that just makes you look better.

[18:54] Right.

[18:54] But the dog one specifically.

[18:56] You're taking pictures and videos.

[18:57] That was huge.

[18:58] That was like parallel to the duck face.

[19:00] Yeah.

[19:01] Slightly accurate.

[19:02] I feel like that one started with like, I can just have this like, actually, I don't know.

[19:07] They're both fucking strange.

[19:09] I think people realize you look better with just a fake nose covering the middle of your face.

[19:14] Oh, yeah.

[19:14] Where you just have your eyes and your smile.

[19:16] Yeah.

[19:16] Yeah.

[19:17] I mean, there's some truth to that.

[19:19] It's just strange.

[19:21] There was one other thing I was thinking about that I remember seen and being like, man,

[19:26] it's just a sign of someone who's just not who was still stuck in like a teenage mindset.

[19:31] I mean, fucking don't remember.

[19:32] But the dog face is definitely one where I see him like, still doing that.

[19:36] And it don't, it probably attracts some people.

[19:39] There's probably some men out there or women have, it's like a selfie, right?

[19:44] Selfie with the duck face.

[19:45] Usually or full body mere shot duck face, peace fingers.

[19:49] Oh, okay.

[19:50] That's a classic.

[19:50] That is a classic.

[19:51] But mostly, mostly selfie, I say, you ever take your own duck face picture?

[19:57] Duck face.

[19:57] No.

[19:58] No.

[19:59] I mean, maybe there's a joke.

[20:01] Yeah.

[20:01] But a serious duck face, like I'm making this my profile picture duck face picture.

[20:06] That'd be insane.

[20:07] Could you imagine it?

[20:08] I mean, dude, it's didn't really do.

[20:10] Right.

[20:10] As a dude, it would be a lot more crazy if it was just on Facebook or like LinkedIn.

[20:17] That'd be amazing.

[20:18] That duck face picture.

[20:21] LinkedIn.

[20:23] Experience data engineer.

[20:26] Yeah, you get hired.

[20:28] Okay.

[20:29] Yeah.

[20:29] Like I said, small point, but I noticed it.

[20:31] And I was like, I thought it was a thing that we would see in high school.

[20:35] And it would stop there.

[20:37] Or it's maybe just those people.

[20:38] I feel like that's kind of along the like, when you look in the mirror, everyone kind of makes a little face to themselves.

[20:45] What is you doing in the mirror?

[20:48] Dude, everyone does it.

[20:50] Everyone does a face mirror.

[20:51] You make a, you like look at yourself in the best light possible.

[20:56] It's very subtle.

[20:57] It's a subtle face.

[21:00] What are you talking about?

[21:01] Like when you take a picture, you're going to make some subtle face.

[21:05] I feel like the duck face is just an extension of that.

[21:09] It's taking it like too far.

[21:12] Can you show me your subtle face?

[21:15] I want to see it, dude.

[21:16] It just looks so hot, dude.

[21:19] But if you took a selfie right now, you're telling me you would just resting bitch face, look at the camera.

[21:25] No, it's mild, probably.

[21:26] Yeah.

[21:27] Or make a silly face on purpose.

[21:29] But try to think like when I look in the mirror, I guess like I do like a coverage thing.

[21:36] Yeah.

[21:36] Well, I'll go, I mean, I'll look at like, get a few different angles, but it's.

[21:41] Next.

[21:42] I guess when I'm not like changing my face, if that makes sense, I think you do.

[21:47] You think so?

[21:47] And everyone does it a little bit.

[21:51] Yeah.

[21:52] I guess if you look for it, next time you look in the mirror, I guess if you look at it, if you see someone else looking at me,

[21:56] they are doing something specific.

[22:00] But yeah, I guess when you say something to start with your face, I don't like it feels like I'm not doing something with my face as opposed to like looking in the mirror a certain way.

[22:11] Like the dog face feels like an active.

[22:14] Yeah, that's literally making a face.

[22:16] Yeah, like there's energy put into contorting your face to do something where I don't feel like when I look in the mirror, I'm moving my face.

[22:22] Now, you don't like like throw the eyebrows up just do.

[22:25] Maybe sometimes.

[22:27] Yeah, yeah, check yourself out a little bit.

[22:30] I mean, yeah, that definitely happens.

[22:31] Yeah.

[22:31] But the contortion of the face is fucking crazy.

[22:36] I will have you heard, like you look more attractive than you actually are to yourself.

[22:43] See, you know, I don't know if I've heard that.

[22:45] I've heard that.

[22:45] I feel like that.

[22:47] You think that's because you look at yourself in the best light.

[22:50] And you look at like the angles that are the best.

[22:55] Oh, my bad.

[22:56] I thought you were saying the opposite.

[22:57] I thought you were saying that you look better than you look in the mirror.

[23:00] But you look better in the mirror.

[23:01] You look better to yourself and your own reflection than you do to everyone else.

[23:05] Yeah, absolutely.

[23:06] Which is so sad.

[23:07] But then there's the other part that says that in pictures and videos, you never see how you're truly seen by other people.

[23:15] So like, because you can, you can like almost.

[23:18] I think it's closer than like looking at a mirror by yourself.

[23:22] I would say so.

[23:24] There's.

[23:26] Because like, you know how it's Snapchat, like the front facing cameras give you like a not real image of yourself.

[23:32] But if you ever take a picture of yourself with on it flips.

[23:35] Yeah, that's more of a really like holy fuck.

[23:39] Yeah, and then you're lopsided as wow, I'm bad.

[23:41] Yeah.

[23:41] But then there's the thing of.

[23:44] You don't see your face like how you look like the still images don't look that way.

[23:49] So it's somewhere in between mirror and picture probably farther away from picture and closer to mirror.

[23:56] Image.

[23:57] But you're still when you look in the mirror, you're like you said, you're going to blast it with full light.

[24:02] There's you can see just all of your best features.

[24:05] Yeah.

[24:06] And you're used to your face that way.

[24:09] You're used to a mirror image of your face.

[24:12] Yeah.

[24:12] Which everyone's face is lopsided.

[24:14] Yeah.

[24:15] So when it flips, it's literally the opposite lopsided and it's like jarring.

[24:19] Yeah, it's pretty scary.

[24:20] Yeah.

[24:21] But what do you do?

[24:22] Can you imagine living in a world without mirrors?

[24:25] I'm not knowing what you looked like.

[24:27] You look at water.

[24:28] No, okay.

[24:29] Reflective services.

[24:31] Humor me.

[24:32] Jesus Christ.

[24:33] It's a goddamn comedy podcast.

[24:36] This is a science podcast.

[24:39] So Pocahonest.

[24:40] No reflective services.

[24:41] No reflective services.

[24:42] You don't know what you look like.

[24:45] How would that think of that?

[24:46] I'm just thinking of people's eyeballs now.

[24:47] You can see yourself in people's eyes.

[24:49] I said no reflective services.

[24:50] So people's eyes would just be glossed over.

[24:52] No, you just the color would be matte.

[24:54] Okay.

[24:55] That'd be crazy.

[24:56] No, not matte.

[24:56] But you know, it's not reflective.

[24:57] I got Jesus Christ.

[25:00] That'd be wild.

[25:01] You know what I keep talking about this.

[25:02] No pictures either.

[25:04] No video.

[25:05] Yeah.

[25:06] Yeah.

[25:06] Just say there's no way to know how to do that.

[25:09] That's a lot of work.

[25:09] Think about how your life would be different.

[25:11] Like a lot of life is around like how you look.

[25:15] That would be hard.

[25:18] What is that?

[25:18] That would be worse.

[25:20] Why?

[25:21] Cause you got to know when you're ugly.

[25:25] Do you, Jesus Christ.

[25:28] Cause you got to, you need to know what you look like or else you're just going to have to decipher.

[25:33] Oh, this is kind of true anyway.

[25:34] If you're not an attractive person.

[25:36] Yeah.

[25:37] No one's going to tell you that.

[25:38] You got to figure that shit out.

[25:40] Yeah.

[25:41] I mean, it's easier.

[25:44] It's easier.

[25:44] Or, or, or, let's take an easier thing.

[25:46] Okay.

[25:47] What if you have some shit on your face?

[25:49] I'll tell you.

[25:50] Okay.

[25:51] How far does that go?

[25:53] With poop on your face?

[25:54] No, no, no.

[25:55] Like what if, what if you're just a hideous person?

[25:58] No one's going to tell you that.

[26:00] That's fine.

[26:00] What's the, okay.

[26:02] Let's back up.

[26:03] And don't get me wrong.

[26:03] This is, I'm taking like the high devil's advocate road that would, you know,

[26:08] I hear your voice.

[26:10] Yeah.

[26:12] But by, what does someone get by someone telling them that they're hideous?

[26:16] How does that help anything with that person?

[26:20] It brings your expectations down to reality.

[26:24] I don't know if I believe.

[26:26] If you see a beautiful person and they get all the attention, they get all the dates.

[26:31] Sure.

[26:31] Get all the girls, all the guys, whatever.

[26:34] And you're, you're like, why can't I have that?

[26:36] You need to understand why.

[26:39] Why though?

[26:40] I feel like that's because going back to the last episode where you talk about it,

[26:44] someone was fucking Stephen Hawking.

[26:47] Yeah.

[26:48] Not a looker by any means.

[26:50] Yes.

[26:51] And pulled.

[26:52] I would, I would, I would argue that.

[26:58] Seen, when a tried to person calls about a lot of people to be attracted to them.

[27:02] And you're not having people attracted to you.

[27:04] And being like, if you had, if you come to, if you looked in a mirror and go,

[27:08] oh, I'm obviously so much uglier than this person.

[27:12] All it does is, is kind of bind you to that.

[27:15] You then go, because I'm ugly, right?

[27:18] I don't get this.

[27:19] So there's no chance.

[27:20] You can take it too far.

[27:21] You can like give it all the power.

[27:23] It's so demotivating.

[27:25] I mean, if you, if you see, oh, I have no, there's people like that out there that are super beautiful.

[27:29] I have no chance.

[27:30] Then you believe that you cannot achieve that.

[27:32] And I would argue, at least for men, it's unfortunate for women,

[27:39] because I feel like it's not as similar.

[27:42] But girls will go out with some hideous dudes.

[27:45] Yeah.

[27:45] And like, marry them.

[27:47] And huge.

[27:48] And they can see past the physical.

[27:50] Like we've talked about before.

[27:52] And for women, it's harder.

[27:54] Men look a little bit more, I don't know.

[27:58] That's a big generalization.

[28:00] But it seems like a lot of men are more physical oriented.

[28:05] And then, oh, yeah.

[28:08] Women will just not be.

[28:10] Yeah.

[28:11] So I don't know.

[28:12] I don't know what it does for someone.

[28:14] If they know they're ugly, relatively.

[28:19] Someone might find them not as ugly.

[28:20] I mean, you're going to figure it out either way.

[28:22] So I guess it doesn't matter.

[28:25] I guess I see the mirrors as more of an obstacle as a cost or a reminder, if you're ugly.

[28:30] And it helps the hotter people as a cost or a reminder, they're hotter.

[28:34] And then it just creates false sense of self.

[28:37] I feel like.

[28:38] Okay.

[28:39] Because you could be having a great days of ugly person, and you walk by reflective service, and you go,

[28:43] oh, yeah.

[28:45] And as you didn't have that, the only reminder would be someone coming up to you and going,

[28:49] you're fucking ugly.

[28:54] Well, that would be brutal.

[28:56] Nope.

[28:57] That's probably not going to happen.

[28:58] But like, if it looks truly did not matter at all, then I would agree with you, but they

[29:06] do.

[29:06] They impact your life.

[29:08] I agree with that.

[29:09] Yeah, for sure.

[29:10] So I just feel like it's better to know.

[29:13] Like if no one's going to tell you you're ugly, but like people are going to reject you,

[29:17] people are going to shut down when you try to talk to them.

[29:20] Yeah, but what is, yeah.

[29:22] I guess then you're like, but how to take the flip?

[29:25] It's like, oh, it must be me.

[29:27] It must be like, who I am as a person that sucks.

[29:30] That's fair.

[29:30] I guess there could be confusion there.

[29:32] So you're saying that the image could be actually clearing over the mind of being like, oh,

[29:36] I'm just fucking ugly.

[29:37] Yeah.

[29:40] There's a lot of like very healthy average looking people who are like, I know what I look like.

[29:46] Yeah.

[29:47] And I think that's good.

[29:49] Yeah.

[29:50] Yeah.

[29:50] And also there's, there's, there's negatives, major negatives of being like the top echelon

[29:56] of attractiveness too.

[29:57] That can set you up on a very difficult path to.

[30:02] Yeah.

[30:03] Yeah.

[30:03] I would argue average is about where you want to be.

[30:05] With most things.

[30:07] Where to stay average?

[30:09] I mean, in turn, I would say average being like the middle of the road, you know?

[30:13] Like you can be your extreme, most people on either extreme burnout on one way or another.

[30:20] They just do whether it be showing up a school because they're so terribly depressed and that

[30:25] or you're super hot and or you're super athletic and you go to the NFL and you use burn your

[30:30] body out.

[30:31] Granted, it doesn't happen to everyone.

[30:32] I'm saying the degree to what it happens on the extremist is extreme.

[30:37] And then the average life is not as extreme because not that.

[30:40] But then it's yeah, are the highs and lows that worth it?

[30:44] Like if you could experience being an NFL player, be pretty cool.

[30:48] Be pretty cool.

[30:49] A lot of CTE.

[30:50] Yeah.

[30:51] Well, you'd be like a kicker.

[30:53] Side step all of the CTE and just kick balls into a minute.

[30:56] Still take some hits.

[30:57] But yeah.

[30:58] Yeah.

[30:59] Anyway.

[30:59] Also, I feel like someone would, people would draw each other and you would kind of,

[31:05] you should, like, you continue to find loop holes on the point is just you can't see

[31:09] what you look like.

[31:10] You can't know.

[31:11] So no one can draw in this universe.

[31:13] Well, they have edge sketches actually.

[31:14] Oh, shit.

[31:15] I don't know if they have that stuff.

[31:16] So you can draw through those tough, those means only.

[31:19] That's a tough way to wrap your face.

[31:22] All I'm saying is I think it'd be really interesting because think of your day, how many

[31:25] times do you look in a mirror?

[31:27] I mean, every bathroom time.

[31:28] 90% of my time.

[31:28] You're just staring into a mirror.

[31:32] I mean, it's, I mean, realistically, it'd probably be good.

[31:36] I think, I think I'm probably more on your side.

[31:38] We could do this in experiment.

[31:41] No.

[31:41] I mean, the show, the show love is blind is kind of doing it.

[31:44] Really?

[31:45] Wait, what is, it's a reality TV show where you, you, this is the autism one, right?

[31:50] I love on the spectrum.

[31:51] No, also good show.

[31:54] They, you, you date people with, you never see them.

[31:57] There's like a curtain between you and you like have conversations.

[32:00] And then at the end, you see each other and you get married and then divorced immediately.

[32:05] Like every reality TV show.

[32:07] There's that new one that's on each, I think it's on HBO.

[32:10] Were the naked one?

[32:11] Have you seen this naked in a parade?

[32:13] No, no, no, no, it's a danger where they're naked.

[32:15] You see the person's naked body and you don't see their head.

[32:19] And yeah, it's the, it's the, it's the, it's the, it's the head off.

[32:23] Yeah, should you just put a bag over the head?

[32:25] No, they like cut like visually they have like a thing where people are standing.

[32:28] So you can't see that.

[32:29] Oh my God.

[32:30] They're doing everything.

[32:31] They're doing everything.

[32:32] I haven't, I haven't watched it yet, but I've heard all these things about it.

[32:34] It's literally just, it's something you never thought would be on TV.

[32:39] But you're just seeing naked people and then people that, you know, they, I'm pretty

[32:44] sure they just judged them off their body and then do they talk to the person?

[32:49] I think so.

[32:50] We should watch an episode because I haven't seen it.

[32:53] It sounds, it definitely hasn't been done yet.

[32:56] Yeah, it's a new concept.

[32:58] But that's like the love is blind to the extreme on the other end where you can only see

[33:04] their body.

[33:04] It's a title as show.

[33:07] It's something naked.

[33:09] Like what are they trying to say?

[33:11] Cause like love is blind as a clear message.

[33:12] They're trying to see how shallow are people bit, you know, it's the reverse.

[33:16] It's how shallow are because you're literally going off of just their body.

[33:20] I'm pretty sure.

[33:22] But well, it's kind of like a cop because you, it's weird you can't see their face either.

[33:27] Then I think you're also talking to them.

[33:30] I didn't do my research.

[33:31] I just know that they're naked.

[33:34] That's crazy.

[33:34] Yeah.

[33:35] And it's a dating show.

[33:36] Fucking nuts.

[33:37] Right.

[33:37] All right.

[33:38] Let's move on.

[33:39] That all started from the duck face, by the way.

[33:41] That took a big tangent.

[33:45] First of all, do you have anything you want to know?

[33:47] I never do.

[33:49] All right.

[33:50] You just invite me over here to just start talking to a fucking wall.

[33:57] No.

[33:57] So you probably know this though, that like all of the fiber optic cables that connect everything

[34:04] are like run under the ocean across the world.

[34:07] How is that?

[34:08] It's crazy.

[34:09] I found that out like kind of recently.

[34:11] I knew it for a while, but then I didn't.

[34:13] It sounded fake when I first heard it.

[34:16] Yeah.

[34:16] What would they be?

[34:18] It's just something I like obviously it has to be that way, but I just had never thought

[34:24] about it enough.

[34:25] I just thought there was some like level of radio transmission that was going to other

[34:28] like we didn't need wires for certain things, but that's not the truth.

[34:32] Well, I mean, we don't do it just be slow.

[34:35] Right.

[34:36] So we could use satellites if we wanted to.

[34:40] Sure.

[34:41] But yeah.

[34:42] But yeah, I just I saw like a globe, like a 3D map of the world.

[34:47] It's just webs covering the whole ocean.

[34:50] That's crazy.

[34:51] Also like when did that start?

[34:53] How long did it take?

[34:55] Like that's that project is huge.

[34:57] You're going to the bottom of the ocean.

[35:00] Yes, crazy.

[35:01] That's so nuts and to connect the world.

[35:04] It's fucking nuts.

[35:05] I don't I don't have anything really to do it.

[35:08] It's just crazy.

[35:10] I was reading it was like what all that a lot of the things you look up are just going

[35:15] under the ocean.

[35:16] You're causing electricity to go under the ocean.

[35:20] I didn't understand that when you first saw it.

[35:22] I was like, okay, nice.

[35:25] But yeah, that that's fucking saying that it's it's doing that.

[35:28] So anyway, that's it.

[35:31] Uh, I don't remember.

[35:34] I don't you know Oliver Anthony is.

[35:37] He's the uh, uh, what's the song of rich men North rich men guy.

[35:43] Oh, yeah.

[35:45] Why the fuck did I write that name down?

[35:47] I threw that on there.

[35:48] I mean, that was like right when it came out.

[35:50] It's been so long since that's out now.

[35:53] So what about it?

[35:54] It was just kind of nuts.

[35:56] Like the song.

[35:58] What do you mean the reaction?

[35:59] How you blew up.

[36:01] Like there were a lot of people.

[36:02] A lot of people thought it was fake.

[36:05] Thought conservatives planted them.

[36:07] Interesting.

[36:08] And then like fake made him viral to put that song out there.

[36:12] Which I don't think happened.

[36:15] But yeah, I don't think so either.

[36:18] I mean, when you go in like Joe Rogan soon after that whole thing happened.

[36:21] Yeah, he won on Joe Rogan.

[36:22] Yeah, seems like a super cool dude.

[36:24] Yeah, the last thing that hurts that some record deal offered him like, you know, arena tours.

[36:30] Bring it down because he was like, that's not this is the opposite of what I'm like doing.

[36:35] Use like I just wrote this song that says everything against that kind of stuff.

[36:39] But I'm like, take the money.

[36:41] Yeah, do get out of that.

[36:44] I mean, that song he wrote, he just sounds like he needs money.

[36:48] Yeah, he sounds dire situation.

[36:50] He sounds so poor.

[36:53] Yeah, I don't know.

[36:55] It's weird because I feel like if you're, if you have what, when you're that person who goes,

[37:02] I'm not going to take the money.

[37:04] And this is, I don't want to say like a throwing judgment, but I am.

[37:08] Why would you not?

[37:11] Doesn't it then open up the door for music to everybody that you want to share this with?

[37:17] Yeah, you're making music.

[37:19] So I don't, I don't understand.

[37:22] If it's coming from good people like it was from like Saudi Arabia to golf there, for example,

[37:27] I would be like, I'm not taking that money.

[37:30] But yeah, you take it.

[37:31] I don't know.

[37:32] Take all that money.

[37:34] Are, is the PGA that much better?

[37:36] It's just a bunch of rich white dudes doing, they're probably doing equally as terrible things.

[37:41] Maybe.

[37:42] I know Saudi Arabia is not a, not a great place.

[37:45] But it's like if, it's what that thing were, if you drill down to the dollar of all these mega corporations and what they do,

[37:51] it's probably equally bad across the system.

[37:54] Yeah, but it's like the people who are, here's the thing.

[37:57] Human behavior, pretty similar across the board in terms of human history and how people act and do things and between not having enough resources and how they act or having too many resources and how they act.

[38:09] And there's varying degrees, but there's similar behaviors across the board.

[38:13] So you're telling me that the people in Saudi Arabia who are billionaires are drastically different than the people who are billionaires in the United States.

[38:21] Like, mostly, I understand that religion and views can be different.

[38:25] Well, the people in the US aren't just getting paid by billionaires to call.

[38:31] They're, they're like, they're paid by ticket sales and like full PGA.

[38:37] Yeah, but the sponsorship when I talk about that, I mean, they're making tons and tons of money.

[38:40] Yeah.

[38:42] Maybe, yeah, I don't know.

[38:45] It's just weird to, I mean, but for like other sports, they get contracts for tens of millions of dollars and stuff like that.

[38:51] I mean, the golfers aren't getting paid billions of dollars.

[38:55] They're getting paid like 100 million dollars and millions.

[38:58] But it's just, I don't know, man.

[39:00] It's, I don't know.

[39:02] I think our golf manifested a little more naturally.

[39:08] And whereas like Saudi Arabia is just kind of forcing it by just throwing obscene amounts of money at these people that leave to go to Saudi Arabia.

[39:17] When they play in Saudi Arabia, I thought it was just a league that's owned by Saudi Arabia.

[39:23] I actually don't know.

[39:24] Yeah, I thought, that's where I saw people actually know what I don't even know what Saudi Arabia is Saudi Arabia just a bit mostly desert.

[39:31] Sounds like it.

[39:32] Yeah, it is Arabia.

[39:34] I know so little about, this is why you don't listen to my advice or my, I know so little about, I know all I know is that they're like,

[39:43] you know, they act similar to extreme, at least the giant oil type, like they're, you know, women can't drive, women are essentially just, you know, that kind of situation where they're subhuman in that country, which is not good.

[40:00] Yeah, you know, so that's all I really know.

[40:04] And then doing like, you know, they hold all the power, they have a ton of money.

[40:08] There's way more poor than there is rich relative to America, I should say, but I don't fucking know.

[40:16] Anyway, Oliver Anthony take the fuck off.

[40:18] Oh, okay.

[40:19] Yeah, take the money.

[40:20] Take the money.

[40:21] It's one that I don't know.

[40:22] It help yourself out, man.

[40:24] No one's going to care.

[40:25] There might be a few haters online, like a hundred people who are like, fuck, damn, I'm going to, how about this?

[40:31] Act like you wouldn't sell out if you were Oliver Anthony.

[40:34] Like, vote.

[40:34] Talking about the haters now, you know.

[40:36] Exactly.

[40:37] And also, who the fuck is commenting on YouTube?

[40:40] Who's commenting on anything online?

[40:43] Who are these people?

[40:44] I should say who are the negative ones?

[40:47] Do you know someone in your life that is commented on something?

[40:52] I guess they would comment on shit all the time.

[40:54] Just kidding.

[40:55] I know you do.

[40:56] It's, I feel like you just have no time and you, or too much time and you're, you just are mad about something in your life.

[41:04] But so many people, people will get mad so people don't do that.

[41:09] There's like a small, like you look on a video on YouTube or something that has 200,000 views.

[41:17] There's not 200,000 comments.

[41:19] There's like, I don't know.

[41:21] True.

[41:21] 10,000.

[41:23] It's the smallest subset of people who are, I mean, and then you, then you go down to the negative ones.

[41:28] You take out of the 10,000 comments, you have a hundred bad ones.

[41:33] Who are those people?

[41:35] The trolls.

[41:36] I get there.

[41:38] But they, some of them have to be legitimately mad enough and go, I'm going to leave a comment on this.

[41:45] Yeah.

[41:45] It's crazy.

[41:47] I am doing that.

[41:48] I imagine it's like a release for them.

[41:51] I can't feel good.

[41:53] That's like to just spew that hatred.

[41:55] Have you ever gone to an online argument with anybody?

[41:58] Well they're,

[41:59] they're all tabled on Reddit.

[42:01] Never feel, wait, really?

[42:02] Unread it?

[42:03] No, but can you tell me about it?

[42:05] No.

[42:06] It's that crazy.

[42:09] Are you being serious?

[42:10] Have you?

[42:10] I'm serious.

[42:11] I have.

[42:12] You talking to tell me?

[42:14] No.

[42:15] I'll tell you off.

[42:16] She's quite.

[42:18] It's about women's rights and Saudi Arabia.

[42:21] They should stay subhuman.

[42:25] Yeah, I mean, I've done it on Facebook years ago.

[42:29] One or two times.

[42:31] And even when you win and winning, it's impossible.

[42:36] You don't fit.

[42:37] It's not like a conversation.

[42:38] I feel still fucking mad.

[42:41] Yeah.

[42:41] I'm still like, ah, even though arguing like ever is pretty much never good.

[42:48] I don't know about, are you saying online?

[42:50] Not like ever.

[42:52] I don't know about that.

[42:53] How are we going to have here?

[42:55] We're arguing right now about this point.

[42:57] I wouldn't call this an argument.

[42:59] What's an argument?

[43:00] Call us a discussion.

[43:01] All right, what's an argument?

[43:05] I think when it gets heated and it gets emotional and you stop like really thinking about logic

[43:14] versus just what your point isn't doubling down on it.

[43:18] That's where it turns into an argument.

[43:20] But then it's like every conversation has that.

[43:23] Like no one is robotic in the sense of like, let's have the debate.

[43:29] Like that, it just doesn't.

[43:30] Yeah.

[43:31] And then you need not saying you want the crazy screaming at each other argument.

[43:36] But there's a level where I should say when respecting the other person's view falls out of it.

[43:42] Sure.

[43:42] When that drops out and you're just throwing hands, that never leads to anything good.

[43:49] Greg Zinapel, that happened two weeks ago and we're at uptown and we're hanging out and our friend who we play tennis with said

[44:00] there was a study where people took anabolic steroids and they didn't do anything and they gained ten pounds of muscle.

[44:08] And I said, I don't think that's true.

[44:12] And then this is how I, when you say argument, this is how I view it where I go.

[44:16] I don't think so.

[44:18] And then you go and I, we talk about it a little bit and like you would have, you need insult to the muscle to make it grow.

[44:24] You can't just, a muscle will just not, it won't just, it will not just grow without anything applied to it.

[44:31] Just not how that works.

[44:34] And so then I was like, we just talked with, you know, it's not like he pulled up on his phone or anything like that.

[44:40] So there's nowhere to go with it.

[44:41] But I said, I don't, I don't agree with that.

[44:43] And it was fine.

[44:43] We're like, okay, I explain why I don't agree with that.

[44:47] And then I don't know.

[44:50] So this is continuing this, but so we talked about that.

[44:53] And then the next day I looked it up and it was like this study where they gave testosterone and people and told them don't go to the gym.

[45:03] And then the people did gain six pounds of muscle that were told to not do anything.

[45:10] But then all of the muscle gain was in the quadricep suggesting that they're just walking around.

[45:18] Like other groups were gaining muscles and that were told that you can work out suggesting that you take on a ball of steroids if you start walking around.

[45:27] Like you're going to gain muscle there because your body so sensitive and anabolic that when you're using certain muscles, they're going to start growing to some extent.

[45:36] But if you took someone in a vacuum and you put them on a couch for a week and you give them anabolic steroids, you're not going to gain muscle.

[45:43] You need some kind of mechanical tension to tell your muscle to grow.

[45:48] Otherwise, it just sits in that state.

[45:51] So he was from without digging into the methods and where the muscle gains were, he's right.

[45:58] Yeah.

[45:58] But you need mechanical tension, man. Trust me.

[46:02] Yeah, that makes sense.

[46:04] Anyway, back to the point of arguing. I think there can be good arguing.

[46:10] But it's, I guess, arguing has a bad connotation to it with the name.

[46:16] I wouldn't say most conversations are like, first of all, this is an argument you won.

[46:22] So I mean, maybe it was cool with it.

[46:27] Maybe he goes home and he's sad.

[46:30] Could be.

[46:31] Like what if he was right?

[46:33] What if he was truly right?

[46:35] Like you were actually wrong.

[46:37] And he backed it up.

[46:39] Here's our IC.

[46:41] If it happened in the moment and he said, I was wrong or if he says you're wrong, you say he's wrong.

[46:48] You go home, you read a study and you're like, oh shit, he's right.

[46:51] I would, I would reach out to him.

[46:53] I don't reach out to him because now because I don't want to be like, hey, remember what I said?

[46:56] Yeah, I don't want to do that.

[46:57] But if I found out I was wrong, I'd go, dude, you were totally right.

[47:00] I was wrong because that would be, it would go against everything I know about resistance training.

[47:05] Yeah, like it just does.

[47:06] But I would, they'd be fucking nuts because I feel like if someone teaches me something, I want to go, thanks, dude, that was.

[47:13] Yeah, I like having those friends around it more than someone if I say something like, fuck yeah, that's awesome.

[47:19] If I say something crazy, but his, his wasn't crazy.

[47:23] It was just, if you don't dig it, if you read the abstract of a lot of studies, it'll give you stuff that.

[47:29] So, so that one is.

[47:32] There's like a pretty clear right and wrong on that one.

[47:35] Sure.

[47:37] If it was like politics though, or choosing the hardest one, there's no hands.

[47:44] Okay, anything else.

[47:45] Like does God exist?

[47:49] No, I don't.

[47:52] People argue about that shit.

[47:53] Some of the hard, the most complex, there's no right answer at all.

[47:56] Okay, anything that doesn't have a right answer, that's what I'm saying.

[47:58] People argue about that shit probably the most, via Melody.

[48:03] And that's like, talk about strong opinions.

[48:05] When you contradict someone, it takes like a pillar of their personality, like it's an attack on them.

[48:12] Sure.

[48:13] Yeah.

[48:14] So, that's a bit.

[48:14] In those scenarios, I don't, I often think it's better to not argue.

[48:20] Yeah.

[48:21] I mean, when we're talking about metaphysical stuff that we're never going to have an answer to, I agree.

[48:26] I think politics is one that you could have more of a material answer, but people use emotion to sway people away from the right way to do things.

[48:37] But like, I mean, I'm on board with that.

[48:41] If you're arguing about something that doesn't have any solution, it's never going to be good.

[48:46] And if you have to oppose, argument requires two opposing forces, but arguing about something that you can't find an answer to.

[48:52] Yeah, that's going to be terrible.

[48:53] And you feel so strongly about, which is kind of silly.

[48:58] If you're arguing about something you feel strongly about that you don't have the answer to, what are we doing here?

[49:03] A long time ago, a lot of people do.

[49:06] Oh, yeah, dude.

[49:07] There's a human part that we just do that.

[49:10] We talked about a while ago, and like an earlier podcast about, I had a pet peeve about people being strongly opinionated on stuff that they don't know anything about.

[49:18] Yeah.

[49:18] That would be like the God argument.

[49:20] You don't know.

[49:21] You know nothing.

[49:22] All we have is this book that was written thousands of years ago, and we go, well, this is it.

[49:28] It's not the bash all religion, because I think there's something going on.

[49:33] But man, talk about the silliest argument to ever exist.

[49:38] There's entire countries that are fighting right now over it.

[49:41] Right.

[49:42] It's crazy.

[49:43] We've been doing that since the beginning.

[49:45] I know.

[49:46] It's all about who's got the best nuance diversion of what?

[49:52] What's going on?

[49:53] What they assume is going on with whatever power is running all this.

[49:56] Why does it matter?

[49:57] Israel Palestine, bad argument.

[50:00] They should not be arguing.

[50:02] They should be hugging.

[50:04] Yeah.

[50:05] I don't know.

[50:07] But like, take arguments to a smaller level.

[50:09] Politics is also, I'd say, once again, super complex.

[50:12] Before arguing on where we want to go for dinner.

[50:15] They go, I want to go to fucking chilies.

[50:17] They have the best chicken fingers, and you're like, I want to go to fucking portillos.

[50:20] I want a hot dog.

[50:22] Through arguing, we can get to a place of a solution.

[50:27] Otherwise, see how it, I'll be like, let's just go to chilies.

[50:29] I don't want to piss you off.

[50:31] Okay, you got to give me something here.

[50:33] What's that argument?

[50:34] I'm being real right now.

[50:35] Like, I, that's fair.

[50:36] And small things like that.

[50:37] Why would you argue about it?

[50:40] Because you, because we both want to go to a place that, but I'm with you.

[50:44] I do the same thing.

[50:45] Someone's like, no, I want to go to portillos.

[50:46] I'm like, that's fine.

[50:47] But yeah.

[50:48] If you felt you wanted something, you have a reason why you want that thing.

[50:52] That's legitimate.

[50:53] As opposed to the God one, it's hard to have a legitimate reason why.

[50:57] Disgods better than this God.

[50:59] But like, if I'm like, I want to go to this place because they have tacos.

[51:02] And I like tacos.

[51:03] And you say, and listen, and the more you argue about, the more you figure out,

[51:08] the reasons for wanting each thing, and you could probably find something in between.

[51:13] That offers both solutions.

[51:15] Tacos and hot dogs.

[51:17] Yes.

[51:17] Tacos hot dogs that are in taco shells.

[51:20] Sounds awesome.

[51:21] But I'm just saying, argument gives the stage to figure things out.

[51:26] And if you, and if you avoid all arguments, you end up just never getting what you want at all.

[51:30] True.

[51:32] There's got to be some level.

[51:33] I can hear you out there, where there's, I feel like arguing is associated with something.

[51:36] I think, uh, emotional screaming.

[51:40] A lot.

[51:40] So, so back to what you said about.

[51:44] Oh, bleeps.

[51:45] Yeah, it's going to say, uh, cheese.

[51:47] Really paused.

[51:48] I'm going to take our sat in anyway.

[51:51] Like if he said that to me, I'd probably be like, nice man.

[51:54] Right.

[51:55] Which is, but that's like with a lot of this goes.

[52:00] Remember a while ago, we talked about the correction culture.

[52:04] Yeah.

[52:04] Like someone brings up a fact and everyone jumps like, no, that's wrong.

[52:09] Right.

[52:09] That I avoid unless it's like really ridiculous.

[52:13] Yeah.

[52:13] Or I, I, because that what I'm avoiding is just the stab at someone's ego.

[52:20] Sure.

[52:20] For sure.

[52:21] And people hold a lot of like, it sucks to be told you wrong.

[52:24] Whatever the scale is.

[52:25] For sure.

[52:26] Big or small.

[52:27] I try to avoid that at all costs.

[52:28] Unless it's something that I have to argue about that I really care about.

[52:33] That's fair.

[52:34] In this situation, we were referencing.

[52:37] It's one that I, without looking at, I want, I don't, either, I want to know that this

[52:43] is this crazy outlier.

[52:45] Yeah.

[52:45] And it does exist.

[52:47] But for my knowledge, it's hard.

[52:49] With all the signs, you can't argue that that's possible.

[52:52] Yeah.

[52:52] Behind it.

[52:53] So then I, I go, I want to know it.

[52:56] Mine's more like, and don't get me wrong.

[52:58] There's nothing.

[52:59] There is part of the ego that's like, I'm right, you're wrong.

[53:02] And there's that, there's that part.

[53:03] But I really want to know.

[53:05] I want to know why.

[53:06] Why?

[53:06] What is this thing that you're talking about?

[53:08] Because from everything I know, that can't happen.

[53:13] Which, yeah.

[53:14] Now that we're talking about, it sounds fucking not great.

[53:18] No, I think it makes sense for me, we should bring the other guy on.

[53:24] See how he feels.

[53:25] He's just a depressed guy.

[53:26] That's for weeks.

[53:27] I'm so sorry, man.

[53:29] Can you think of a time when you've truly been corrected?

[53:33] And 180 degree, you were wrong.

[53:36] Many times trying to think of a specific one.

[53:38] That's hard.

[53:39] But I mean, I know the feeling.

[53:42] Yeah, they can remember the notion of like, it's kind of a dagger.

[53:46] It hurts a little bit.

[53:49] At the same time, I'd rather...

[53:51] You want to know, though.

[53:52] I'd rather be the person who it hurts one time.

[53:55] And I'm no longer making...

[53:58] And this is not referring to this situation that we're talking about.

[54:00] I know that there's moments in my life where I've been doing the wrong thing.

[54:04] And it's making me look stupid as fuck.

[54:06] And until someone goes, that's not how you want to know.

[54:09] I want to know that.

[54:10] I don't want to be...

[54:12] Look at this fucking clown doing this for real because no one's told him.

[54:16] Yeah.

[54:16] I don't want that.

[54:17] So I don't know.

[54:19] I'd rather take the one moment over...

[54:21] Right.

[54:22] Oh, I'd mostly ignorant and look at it.

[54:23] One of my best friends was a guy who called me out on some shit.

[54:27] And I'm like, thank you, dude, for telling me.

[54:30] Because I appreciate that.

[54:32] Yeah, versus, you know, the other friend who just kind of lets it go.

[54:36] Yeah.

[54:38] Those are good friends.

[54:39] Two a degree.

[54:40] If you have one that's only saying you're fucking crazy, you're shitty.

[54:45] He should be better.

[54:46] That's not good.

[54:47] But anyway, let's move...

[54:50] What time are we at?

[54:52] We're at an hour.

[54:53] We're at an hour.

[54:54] Alright.

[54:54] Wrap it up.

[54:55] Alright.

[54:56] Bye folks.

[54:57] Thanks for tuning in.

[54:58] Bye-bye.